[PC-BSD Dev] Subject: Re: 9.0 Recommendation: partitioning

QT rdirective at gmail.com
Sun Sep 26 11:51:24 PDT 2010

That would require further documentation during install and people do not
read as it is.

The constant posting in the forum about partitioning and failure to boot is
damning evidence that people do not read.

So your proposal would need some very convincing way to make people read or
they will complain!


On Sun, Sep 26, 2010 at 1:46 PM, Lars Engels <lars.engels at 0x20.net> wrote:

> Here's a proposal: let the installer propose the settings according to the
> user's system. If it's amd64 with sufficient RAM, offer him ZFS, if it's
> i386 or not enough RAM, offer him UFS+SU+J and explain the pros and cons of
> having a single or separate partitions.
> BTW, I'd say that separate partitions are better when you want to encrypt
> your hard drive. In most cases it should be enough to encrypt /home and
> swap.
> "Kris Moore" <kris at pcbsd.org> schrieb:
> >
> >
> >"Roger Marquis" <marquis at roble.com> wrote:
> >
> >>Andrei Kolu wrote:
> >>> In case of power failure during some write operations your filesystem
> >>> would be inconsistent, that means after restart your filesystem(s)
> >>> would be READ-ONLY. Now imagine that you got single / partition and
> >>> can't start fsck placed in /stand, you have to start your system from
> >>> livecd or something and hope that your partition scheme is not ruined.
> >>
> >>Journalling is a better protection against boot-time fsck.  At the very
> >>least ufs with soft-updates should be the default filesystem.
> >>
> >>But what Andrei is advocating here is a read-only root.  That is not the
> >>default now and, to the best of my knowledge nobody is seriously
> >>advocating that as a PC-BSD default.  To create a read-only root you'd
> >>need to partition at least /tmp, /usr, and /var, and that would create
> >>more issues than it would solve because:
> >>
> >>  * Every filesystem that has to be mounted at boot is a
> point-of-failure.
> >>
> >>  * Unless you also mounted /home you'd need to symlink /usr/home.  This
> >>    adds another one or two points-of-failure as well as the path issues
> >>    that to accompany directory symlinks.
> >>
> >>  * An unmountable /usr is worse than an an un-fsck'ed root partition
> >>    for all but the most experienced end-users.
> >>
> >>  * Every intra-disk partition reduces the free space of all remaining
> >>    partitions, and increases the risk of diskfull partitions.
> >>
> >>> Disk full trouble from servers of workstations? With single /
> >>> partition your system would be unusable if it is full but with
> >>> multiple partitions you are able to use it and at least delete some
> >>> files.
> >>
> >>Hasn't been my experience but then my systems have all used journalling
> >>filesystems for several years now.  Plus, anyone who knows how to login
> >>to a diskfull system with multi-intra-disk partitions probably also knows
> >>how to "mount -o rw /".
> >>
> >>> Also remember /usr partition  where /usr/home directory with
> >>> all users files are stored. Now recall quota feature. You don't want
> >>> to set quota for your system processes, do you? Quota is set by
> >>> partition.
> >>
> >>If you need quotas you need partitions no question, however, few
> >>end-users need quotas.  If you install non-journalling filesystems you
> >>may also benefit from partitions, at the expense of increasing the
> >>chances you'll experience inconsistent non-root filesystems.
> >>
> >>Bottom line, partitions within a disk create more points of failure than
> >>they eliminate.  This is statistics 101.  IMO, the defaults should
> >>reflect the fact that diskfull issues are more common than quotas and
> >>fsck issues for the average user.  The keywords here are "probability"
> >>and "average user".
> >>
> >>More importantly, and the bottom line for PC-BSD, end-users who
> >>experience diskfull problems due to unnecessary partitioning or fsck
> >>issues due to unjournalled filesystems are more likely to move to an OS
> >>with more intelligent defaults.
> >>
> >>IME,
> >>Roger Marquis
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Dev mailing list
> >>Dev at lists.pcbsd.org
> >>http://lists.pcbsd.org/mailman/listinfo/dev
> >
> >
> >If you want the best of both worlds, just switch to zfs. Using it here,
> and my zpool uses all the disk space, and creating mount points is a snap. I
> don't need to worry about running out of room on / or /usr, plus I can treat
> them as separate partitions.  Or set compression and other options on the
> fly. :)
> >
> >
> >--
> >Kris Moore
> >PC-BSD / iXsystems
> >_______________________________________________
> >Dev mailing list
> >Dev at lists.pcbsd.org
> >http://lists.pcbsd.org/mailman/listinfo/dev
> >
> --
> Diese Nachricht wurde von meinem Android-Mobiltelefon mit K-9 Mail
> gesendet.
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